well then do something about it!

I don’t know what ISKCON is like in the US, but what you describe is definitely not my experience of ISKCON here in Europe. There are several temples I visit(ed) where I always leave spiritually strenghtened.

Several of my non-devotee friends also told me how impressed they were with the spirituality of certain ISKCON temples. The atmosphere, particularly in the temple room did evoke awe in them.

Wait a minute, so wages for sages is a real thing? People actually use that as a good thing? Now, how in the world is the hing supposed to survive with silly things like that going on?

Haribol!
My husband and I were recently asked to join the temple- my husband being a pretty good preacher, and me, the lady who tags along. I can kind of see where the whole payment thing comes from. Like, we’re a young grihasta couple and we have bills, we need to save up for the future, rainy-day funds (in case the temple decided to kick us out in the middle of the night). if we both leave our jobs to preach full-time then where will we get money? What if we want kids? They need a house, dont they? And insurance? And those darn bills? And I need to go back to school eventually, So a little cash from the temple dosent seem like such a bad idea.

Of course we told them that we’d think about it (they offered us $500/month and 50% of any donations we receive) but I dont think we’ll do it- its like stealing from Krishna and I’d rather work like an ass than take money that should be going toward the Deities. But not everyone feels that way.

In India, the bramhacharis dont get paid- my husband told me that they follow that bhakta program book to the letter, they get their tube of toothpaste and their toothbrush, a couple gamchas, couple dhotis etc. every few months. Usually, they’re pretty happy. But there are still some money minded persons, when given the opportunity, come to american temples, and do the same work that they would normally do in India but they get paid sweet bucks for it. Then they marry a white lady and leave the temple. Ah, the ways of life.

Dunno if I agree with you about the energy thing though, no matter what politics go on in the temple, when I step into the temple room, somehow my mood shifts and I feel way more peaceful.

One thing you have to consider is that monks may not receive a salary* but they are also not married. Many of our “sages” are grihasthas and have a family to support as well. I don’t have a problem with the temple supporting them and making sure they have enough money to raise their kids. Brahmacaris, who do not have that same responsibility should not be paid (and I don’t know any brahmacari here that does get paid).

The argument that salaries are for sudras is, in my opinion, symptomatic of devotees naively trying to copy the Indian social system in ISKCON. In a varnasrama society only sudras received a salary because they have a boss, whereas the other varnas are ideally self-employed. But those other varnas do get paid for their work.

* I know of some active (as opposed to contemplative) orders of the Catholic Church that give their people a “budget” — an amount of money each month that should allow them to do what they have to do in the world. They are held accountable for their expenses, though.

I’ve spent a great deal of time researching this very subject. For many years, as a brahmacari in England, I accepted the situation of certain key householders receiving a wage. “It was sanctioned by the GBC so it must be in line with the instructions of Srila Prabhupada” I, oh so naively thought. There were only a handful of paid devotees, all “essential” to preaching and it was “a waste of Iskcon resources, after years of training, to lose them to a karmi job” (quote of a prominent GBC and Guru). Spending many long hours in freezing rain on the street, collecting money to pay the wages of householders in their comfy office, seemed a tad weird. But we had faith in our 1st generation Guru and GBC, he wouldn’t, couldn’t possibly be misleading us could he?
At present, most devotees in that Temple are now being paid a salary.

The development of Vedabase has possibly been the cause of much concern and tribulation to the powers that be. Perhaps that’s why the full version, with the ability to search and cross reference lectures, conversations and letters of Srila Prabhupada costs $400 and the Vedic Library which only has the (edited) books only costs $10.

One day, I thought to myself “I wonder what Srila Prabhupada actually said about wages.” He said a lot more then you might think. I started to compile a list. One side for quotes against Temple wages and the other side for quotes in favor of wages. After some time, one column had many and the other had NONE. Can anyone guess which one was empty? The one against wages of course. All is well, we have not been cheated and lied to by our leaders and Gurus. The system we have now is just as Srila Prabhupada desired. All glories to our wonderful GBC.

Is anyone buying this?

If you answered YES to that last question, please leave your brain at the door, it’s defective.

A couple of years ago, there was a New Vrindaban town meeting to discuss hiring a new Temple Manager. All kinds of big shots were there. GBC’s, Trustees, Board Members, senior devotees galore. When given the chance, I expressed the desire of many 2nd generation devotees to join together in Prabhupada’s sankirtan movement but I had to ask why this new position was automatically a paid one. They didn’t have any intention of asking for a volunteer. This was so very odd you see because there are many, many places where Prabhupada had forbiden Iskcon from paying wages.

Tamohar prabhu, one of the five GBC’s present, explained that “Prabhupada said different things, at different times, in different places and it’s easy to become confused.” I admitted that I had heard that before and that some people could easily be confused. Could he please give me an example of when Srila Prabhupada DID sanction a Temple paying wages. The room fell silent while the prabhu meditated on His Divine Grace, no doubt formulating an answer that would help me understand how things really are. All at once his head drooped a little and the word “NO” came forth. Not to worry, surly one of our other GBC’s can quote an example, I mean, this is a principle that Iskcon’s been working on for the last thirty years. Did an answer come? From anyone; in a room packed with senior devotees? NO. Only silence filled the air and a perhaps a nervous shuffle. Then all at once, they all just carried on with the meeting. Arguing about who was going to get the job.

By the way. That was the last Town Meeting at New Vrindaban for the past two and a half years. We were promised more, but they never happened. Or perhaps we weren’t invited.

Dwija.

The whole wages thing reminds me of a chapter in New Vrindaban history. The “robe era”

Now, while the whole wearing robes, interfaith thing was not something I was ever particularly into, when it was presented by senior devotees of the time such as Kirtananda, Devamrita Swami, Radhanatha Swami, and many Prabhupada disciples and long time devotees, it did have a certain logic to it. (The point is we’re supposed to preach, if this makes it easier for people to accept the message, we should do it.)

I personally did not find that it was better for preaching, but that’s what the senior devotees were saying, so who was I to publicly object.

I will never forget the day that all our gut feelings were completely validated. Someone showed us a letter from years ago where Srila Prabhupada wrote to Kirtananda telling him not to preach in this way. Oh my God! Did I read that right? I could not believe it! How did no one ever point this out before? (This was after several years of the “changes”)

After the winnebago incident it was quite the in vogue thing for big shot devotees to visit New Vrindaban. When Jayadwaita Swami was here there was an open program where he was talking to all of us, mostly about how stupid we were to follow such insanity. He gave a very good example:

If your temple president tells you, “Go preach on 52nd street. Do not go to 48th street.” A situation may come up where once you’re on 52nd street things don’t work out so well, so you may decide to go to any other street, but you’d be a fool to go to 48th street. That would be directly disobeying instructions.

Then he continued to say how no one in ISKCON could believe that we were all following Kirtananda in this, as Prabhupada had specifically said not to do it. I remember thinking at the time that it would have been nice for those who knew about these letters from Srila Prabhupada to show them to us, it could have saved us a lot of suffering. But anyway.

So it seems that now we have a similar situation with temples paying wages. It may even make some sense on some levels to us conditioned souls. But the fact remains that Srila Prabhupada said not to do it.

Have we learned nothing?